Jesus Lied!!!Posted on February 6th, 2009participate 21 comments
Christians are waiting for the end times, when Jesus will come back and do all the wondrous things he promised (you know, the apocalypse and all that).
But the thing was, if Jesus did exist, he was a bloody liar! The promised apocalypse is running WAY behind schedule.
Jesus told his followers he would return in their lifetime:
Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation. – Matthew 23:36
Then he makes a bunch of prophecies, and tells his listeners that these will happen in their lifetime too:
Verily I say unto you, This generation shall not pass, till all these things be fulfilled. – Matthew 24:34
In this passage Jesus claimed that some of the people standing there when he spoke, would still be alive when Jesus came back from heaven:
Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.
It’s not just in Matthew that Jesus’s lies are apparent, he says them all over again in Mark!
Verily I say unto you, that this generation shall not pass, till all these things be done. – Mark 13:30-31
And here Jesus says it again, he’ll be back any day now….
And he said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That there be some of them that stand here, which shall not taste of death, till they have seen the kingdom of God come with power. – Mark 9:1
These words about not tasting death are a recurrent theme, here’s Luke quoting Jesus::
But I tell you of a truth, there be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the kingdom of God. – Luke 9:27
The Christians like telling you that Jesus is coming back, any day now. You’d better believe what they tell you, ’cause their god is just about to jump out of the clouds… But he’s been about to “come back any day now” for a good two thousand years.
The Christians will tell you that I’m interpreting this all wrong, and that any part of the Bible that doesn’t make sense in light of the evidence is a “metaphor”. Rubbish. Go and read it for yourself, the claims of this Jesus character have clearly been contradicted by that book that Christians keep trying to thump us with.
NOTE: All quotes in this post were KJV.
21 responses to to “Jesus Lied!!!”
RePete February 19th, 2009 at 01:45
Just took a quick look at the context of your quote from Matthew 23 and its interesting that Jesus appears to be giving the Religious leaders of the day a good old ear bashing
These guys were like many religious leaders of today who use their positions of power and authority to oppress common people and feather their own nests
Then like today they had gotten into bed with the political power structures to ensure their own security
It would appear that Jesus was being the voice of reason for the poor and marginalized in this case and I am not certain that he was making reference to his return even if some might interpret it this way
The Quote from Mathew 24 seems to incorrect as verse 39 says “and did not know until the flood came and took them all away, so also will the coming of the Son of Man be.”
Reading the whole of Mark chapter 13 there are many things that are not easily understood when read from our perspective and many things may not have been understood by the hearers in the context but at the start of the chapter they are looking towards the temple in Jerusalem and Jesus says that not a stone will be left standing. While he could be accused of exaggeration as there may have been a few stones left standing or even walls the Romans did actually destroy the temple in about 70CE any many of the images described in this passage may have been metaphors for the terrible violence that occurred during this turbulent time in the region
There does not appear to be any explicit prediction of his return
I think we need to be careful not to use single verses of scripture as proof texts to support our opinions whether they be Christian (whatever that means) or atheist
To consistent reason
Indeed, RePete, it seems the business with James and John wanting to sit on JC’s left and right is symptomatic of those who join churches as a means to gaining position and power.
There should be no surprise that the shape of the creature that results is the same as the Pharisaical power structure ruling Jerusalem’s temple and its subsidiary businesses back in those days.
It is interesting that some see Corporate Jesus: my first impression was of a socialist subversive agent.
I also agree with you on the bible-quoting thing: there should be more atheists who can do at least basic theology and biblical hermeneutics. There is a lot of stuff being spouted by christians, which even their own book cannot support.
They deserve to be called on their lies.
geesuss February 19th, 2009 at 13:58
I have fixed the reference for you.
I think there is a lot of problems just using the bible for reference full stop, as with any text, written by man, it can be interpreted differently by any that reads it.
Then you have catholics that say 'We wrote it, so we are the only people that can interpret it properly, and times change, so sections are no longer relevant, the church / nicean creed is where it's at'.
RePete February 19th, 2009 at 04:12
I like Jesus the shit stirrer
As for calling the Christians on their lies unfortunatly I don’t think it is that easy
For most there is a deeply ingrained set of presuppositions that actually prevent them from even considering alternative interpretations these beliefs can even cause physical and mental anguish when confronted
So the answer is safety in numbers and like-mindedness
I understand how atheists might wish to rail against the damaging elements of religion but if encourage compassion for the people who have a whole lot of themselves wrapped up in religion (I trust compassion is a virtue worth affirming here)
As is so often pointed out by atheists militant approaches to groups of differing opinions are never helpful so perhaps as an alternative mutually respectful dialogue may encourage change
There are many in the Christian spectrum who are walking threatening paths as they search for an authentic understanding of their faith which at the core promises to be “good news”
I here you and for many people it would be news that the bible was written by man as they have always been told it was written by God
I think a better understanding of the bible come when you understand it was written by a community by that I mean it is a collection of the stories and events that shaped the Jewish then Christian communities as they developed over time
When trying to interpret any particular section consideration needs to be given to the entire history leading to that point in order to understand some of the perspectives of the characters in the section
As for creeds they are problematic as they are a set of interpretations and perspectives held by a particular group of people in a particular cultural setting. Without this understanding their statements get set in a sort of holy stone and passed on the future generations often becoming accepted as undeniable truth where questioning can result in being ostracized and even eternally damned.
To positive discussion
Justine August 23rd, 2009 at 12:43
Yeah, what they said. From the home page it seems I only get to choose between right-wing, conservative, fundamentalist, homophobic, corporate McChri$tianity, on the one hand, and atheism/agnosticism on the other. Since I’ve been neither of those things for about twenty years and know many like-minded others, I suppose we’re just not that in-your-face…funny, that.
Personally I’m equally bothered by [capital A] Atheism’s new incarnation as a religion of sorts – complete with recruitment drives, posters, bumper stickers, and a major focus on insulting/demeaning those who don’t follow what is deemed to be the correct line of thought etc – as I am by Hillsong et al.
David Allen August 23rd, 2009 at 15:03
Thank you for confirming what I already knew! You’ve said it exactly as Peter said you would.
2 Pet 3:3-13 First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires.
They will say, “Where is this ‘coming’ he promised? Ever since our fathers died, everything goes on as it has since the beginning of creation.”
But they deliberately forget that long ago by God’s word the heavens existed and the earth was formed out of water and by water.
By these waters also the world of that time was deluged and destroyed.
By the same word the present heavens and earth are reserved for fire, being kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.
But do not forget this one thing, dear friends: With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years are like a day.
The Lord is not slow in keeping his promise, as some understand slowness. He is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish, but everyone to come to repentance.
But the day of the Lord will come like a thief. The heavens will disappear with a roar; the elements will be destroyed by fire, and the earth and everything in it will be laid bare.
Since everything will be destroyed in this way, what kind of people ought you to be? You ought to live holy and godly lives as you look forward to the day of God and speed its coming. That day will bring about the destruction of the heavens by fire, and the elements will melt in the heat.
But in keeping with his promise we are looking forward to a new heaven and a new earth, the home of righteousness.
Gee Suss August 23rd, 2009 at 15:21
RePete, past of the problem of the bible was that it was not written by a community as you put forward, but gathered together by those in power and religious. The simple fact that as most all christians claim ‘You have to understand all this, and this, and this to interpret the bible the proper way, my way’ is just ridiculous that a god put forward a book as his word. You would think a god would not deny showing himself, but instead put forward a book that has created some of the biggest divisions in mankind to date, and the death of hundreds of thousands of innocents, because it ‘needs to be interpreted the correct way’.
Gee Suss August 23rd, 2009 at 15:25
David Allen, what you are confirming is that just like hundreds of thousands before you crying ‘the end is nigh!’ you can’t think for yourself, but have to quote from a bronze age book with dubious history to state your opinion.
You confirm the article in your statement, you don’t approach any of the information presented, throw all your ‘faith’ in a book as your conscience and direction. I am sure your god will be very proud that you get all your morals, all your concepts, all your direction in life from a book, rather than the brain that he supposedly gave you.
David Allen August 23rd, 2009 at 15:42
Interesting you can claim to analyse my mindset simply because I happen to make a quote. I would suggest that every single thing you believe (or don’t believe) has come from books that you have been prepared to accept, most likely without too much critical analyses. But, then, I’m making a judgement too, aren’t I.
Sorry about that………….
@Justine: Whose homepage are you talking about, who is offering you a limited number of choices, and who says that all the increasingly-vocal atheists are a single organisation?
Some clarification would be useful.
(I see the rise in numbers of outspoken atheists more as a natural reaction to the increasing incursions of religion into government, personally. If there’s a meeting of the Seekrit Atheist Church, they wisely didn’t invite me.)
Still, carry on being an individual, happy in the knowledge that the Australian Christian Lobby puts so little trust in their god, they have to try and manipulate the government directly.
I may not be a member of a cabal, but I can’t sit on my hands either. If the noise has disturbed your repose, I apologise.
grandfather September 29th, 2009 at 08:15
Hi to all those that do not believe the Bible has anymore relevance or reliability than any other writing.Would someone be more specific? these generalisations and unsubstantiated criticisms need to be expanded.
What do you mean by that?
Gee Suss September 29th, 2009 at 13:03
David Allen, no everything that I know has not come from a book where I have placed faith in something. It comes from evidence and logic, that I have clearly weighed, cross referenced or investigated myself.
I do not harp to trying to justify all new evidence based on bronze age material. I am open to changing my position on any of these things, the problem is, religion is not. There is a VERY big difference in that regard.
grandfather September 29th, 2009 at 18:25
Gee Suss: re comment september 29th at 13.03.
If Jesus was a mythical character created by 4
individuals namely Matthew Mark Luke and John when they must have been old men then they have been exceedingly successful with their deception.The logic to such a conclusion is the fact that some 2,000 years later this figment of their imagination can stir the hearts and minds of countless individuals to do things for the good or bad based on the individuals character.Logic would demand that such a deception on behalf of the four mentioned above would not have lasted very long at all when viewed in the light of the political and religious climate of that time
@Grandfather: it may pay to go a bit deeper into the origins and susbequent alteration, editing and retconning of those gospels.
Could one recommend to you some of Bart Ehrman’s works such as “Lost Christianities”, where you wil lsee some of the self-styled orthodoxies, parallel to your own, which didn’t evolve and survive? (Yes, your expeience of christianity has evolved since the stories in Acts.)
Ehrman’s “Jesus Interrupted” might shock you too:
“1. Only 8 of the 27 books of the New Testament were actually written by the authors to whom they’re attributed. Others are likely forgeries.
2. The gospels provide remarkably divergent portrayals of Jesus. As an example, the crucifixion story varies greatly between the gospels of Mark and Luke. Mark’s account depicts a suffering Jesus crying out “My God, my God, why have your forsaken me?” as he dies. Luke, however, portrays a calm Jesus who simply says “Father, into your hands I commend my spirit.”
3. The message of the Apostle Paul and the message of gospel writer Matthew are completely at odds over the question of whether a follower of Jesus also had to observe the Jewish law.
4. The Nicene Creed and the Trinity were constructs of the later church and are not found in the Bible.
5. Traditional doctrines such as the suffering Messiah, the divinity of Christ, and the notion of heaven and hell are not based on the teachings of the historical Jesus.”
grandfather September 30th, 2009 at 10:31
In reply to Black re Ehrman.
Financial constraints for pensioners make the purchase of books almost impossible.The internet for me still allows a massive amount to be read free of charge.I am well aware of the Biblical criticism that has been around for centuries and unless Mr Erhman has some new insight he will be building on someone elses foundation.There has been a lot of misuse and tampering by way of ommissions and additions which are traced back to the Church of Rome.The accounts given in the four Gospels has already been cast aside as mythology on this website.Why then persist in still shooting the corpse? The teachings contained in the mythology of the NT have influenced society for hundreds of years.Do you agree? has there been any other belief system that allows such freedom? In this country no other system that practices religion need have any fear of being attacked and harmed by Christians,yet in places like parts of India,Pakistan,Iran and Saudi Arabia the Christian is repeatedly attacked and any converts put their life on the line.As to doctrines imposed upon the masses by the Church of Rome to keep them in line these are the teachings of men not the Gospel.
Okay, Grandfather. I know all about lack of money. Still, if you don’t read (btw, I did study considerable theology at one stage) you might avoid criticising from a POV of supposition. Perhaps the Internet might give you some extracts of Ehrman’s work to go on.
Shooting the corpse? No, I see at more as swatting zombies.
Anyway, there’s your time in the comments column used up. See you round.
Gee Suss October 7th, 2009 at 12:22
Your a gullible idiot that’s what you are. But, your not alone, christians look to anything that may justify their fantasies.
Even ‘Answers in Genesis’ a full on creationist website contains the above in the ‘Arguments Creationists should NEVER use’ list and a refutation of the claims by Ron Wyatt
Even the creationist idiot Kent Hovind knows he is a fraud, and Hovind is just a plain ignoramus himself.
Check out their report http://www.answersingenesis.org/creation/v14/i4/report.asp
I mean, if your just accepting this fraud, and other full on hard core creationist loonies themselves state the whole things fraud, and really bad one at that, you are even more of a gullible idiot than the creationists.
What else can I say.
“Bob” (maybe his real name) from an Optus exchange in Burwood, Victoria, with a bogus email address, telling us his version of the Truth?
There’s more than 100% of my daily allowance of irony in that one.
“Bob”, you win! I hereby name our award for lame trollage, the “Bob From Burwood Pennant”.
[...] Suss is a methodical chap, and watched the video. His dissection of it shows… Even ‘Answers in Genesis’ a full on creationist website contains the above in the [...]
As the New Testament was not written by eyewitnesses, how can the so-called "sayings" of Jesus be true and accurate. The NT was not written earlier than 40 years after the alleged crucufixion and the authors are unknown AND, there are no original authored manuscripts in existance. The whole Bible was redone and heavily edited at the Council of Nicea 325CE at the orders of the Pagan Roman Emperor Constantine I. Thus was founded the Holy Roman Catholic and Apostolic Church.
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